Sliders in VC should be able to act like Simple Desk sliders, i.e. overriding the current cue level

Request a feature that you would like to see in QLC+.
Explain in details why you would need it and which is your usage case.
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bleurose
Posts: 26
Joined: Mon Apr 13, 2015 11:42 pm
Real Name: Jon Rosen

Sliders in VC should be able to act like Simple Desk sliders, i.e. overriding the current cue level

Post by bleurose » Mon May 23, 2016 9:47 pm

What I typically do when setting up a theatrical show in QLC+ is I build a virtual console on several pages that has sliders for all of my basic fixtures. This permits me to use the VC like a manual lighting board to control all the levels of all the fixtures. I assume people might say "why not use the Simple Desk" but there are two reasons:

1. The Simple Desk is NOT integrated in the VC operating mode and so sort of stands independent of it which makes it difficult to use while running cues in a cue list, etc.
2. Simple Desk doesn't "set up" nicely for me, it doesn't always put fixtues I want next to each other and doesn't let me "gang up" groups of fixtures. For instance, I might want all my cyc light RGB controls to be setttable from a single set of three RGB sliders, but to set the RGB levels of 8 cyc lights in simple desk means I have to set each one separately.

So using VC as a "virtual manual board" actually works quite nicely WHEN I AM SETTING INITIAL LEVELS.

What I do is use the VC manual mode to set levels for each scene and then record the scenes using DMX Dump. Then I put all the scenes into a chaser and create a cue list and that is where I start running my show.

Now comes the difficult part. I want to change some levels in a scene and modify the scene. I have a few choices, none of which are very good:

1. I can go to Simple Desk and make the changes and reDMX dump the entire scene. This is reasonable for a few minor changes, but again, if I want to change all the colors in a bunch of RGB fixtures, this becomes VERY frustrating. It also means I have to RESET the Simple Desk before going on to the next cue and if I forget, it can come back to haunt me if I record the NEXT change using settings that I didn't want.

2. I use blind mode to modify the scene itself but as I have noted in another feature request, this is cumbersome (and sometimes not reliable in 4.9.1).

3. I can use the VC manual board widgets/sliders to make changes BUT I can ONLY use these IF I AM INCREASING THE LEVELS! I.e., the cue level that is set in the VC cue list/chaser becomes a "minimum level" that I can't override. In regular lighting boards, I can use any slider on the board to override both UP and DOWN any level in a cue, but thise doesn't work on the sliders in QLC+.

I would like to see sliders in VC have either an option of a mode where I can use them to override any current cue level just like the sliders in Simple Desk so that they override both UP and DOWN. That way I could make adjustments in my virtual manual board without having to switch to Simple Desk and back. I could also use this to control gangs of controls (like all the RGB settings or speeds, etc.) with a single slider.

I think this is ONLY a "slider" option, it isn't very useful for buttons (because I can't modify the levels with a button anyway). It might even only be useful in LEVEL mode for a slider, not scene mode or submaster mode. But it would be a very valuable feature for adjusting levels from the VC while you are running a show.

mjack
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Joined: Sat May 14, 2016 1:42 pm
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Re: Sliders in VC should be able to act like Simple Desk sliders, i.e. overriding the current cue level

Post by mjack » Mon May 30, 2016 12:43 am

I'm looking for the same function.

ClubPetey
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Joined: Sun Oct 30, 2016 8:26 am
Real Name: Peter Mueller

Re: Sliders in VC should be able to act like Simple Desk sliders, i.e. overriding the current cue level

Post by ClubPetey » Sun Oct 30, 2016 10:20 am

I also would find this useful, but I could see a use for buttons as well. In the case of a button, it would perform a temporary override of the HTP/LTP setting and force the function's values into the channels, much like the simple desk does.

My use case for this would be something like a lightning effect over ambient color. To get a lightning effect, I want to cut to black momentarily, then to a color (ususaly white) and then back to black. THEN at the end of the function fade back to the color before the function started. As it stands now, I cannot do this because if I have sliders on the VC setting the ambient color, I cannot cut to black because the PARs are HTP and the slider act as a minimum value.

Having a mode where sequences and chasers could force-override the VC sliders would be super useful.

-pete

shortylight
Posts: 31
Joined: Sat Nov 21, 2015 7:06 pm
Location: Münster / Germany
Real Name: Martin Kurze

Re: Sliders in VC should be able to act like Simple Desk sliders, i.e. overriding the current cue level

Post by shortylight » Tue Nov 08, 2016 8:34 pm

Hi,

I also would like to ask for such a fader. It would be great help to use it to reduce or increase the level of
  • a single channel,
  • a group or
  • a scene.
With a reset which returns to the value which is defined by the active scene or effect in a configurable time the function would be perfect as this would be a smooth transition instead of a hard one.

My case is the use of QLC+ in dance shows and musicals in the theatre. As amateur dancers and children take part in the show, it sometimes happens that they do not reach the right position on stage which is stressed by a spot light for example. To be able to reduce the intensity of the spot via fader in such a case would be a big help, as you do not have the time for live editing of the scene.

I know that this is not easy to implement, but it could be a great new feature (in QLC+ version 5) especially for live use of QLC+.

Regards Martin

omar86
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Re: Sliders in VC should be able to act like Simple Desk sliders, i.e. overriding the current cue level

Post by omar86 » Tue Nov 08, 2016 11:58 pm

Nice idea!!

mlohrey
Posts: 114
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Real Name: Mark Lohrey

Re: Sliders in VC should be able to act like Simple Desk sliders, i.e. overriding the current cue level

Post by mlohrey » Wed Nov 09, 2016 3:43 am

Having a special slider would be great for theatre and making adjustments on the fly and, as been mentioned, it is quite difficult to do this live via the live edit process. Although an advantage of live edit is that the required change will be saved for the next show.

It would need to be linked to the 'monitor the selected channels and update the slider level' somehow so that when the slider is adjusted (up or down) the level starts from the level specified in the cue and you don't get a sudden jump.

siegmund
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Real Name: Lukas

Re: Sliders in VC should be able to act like Simple Desk sliders, i.e. overriding the current cue level

Post by siegmund » Wed Nov 09, 2016 11:00 am

I already thought about such a feature, too. The problem is, what to do after a specific value has been modified. So lets stick to this theatre example:

Enable scene which is setting intensity channel - let's say it sets the intensity to 223.
Adjust intensity with a sort of "overriding" slider to maybe 102.
As soon as the scene is over and the next scene should come up (so another intensity value is applied), what should we do now?
A) Reset the "overriding" slider -> so the intensity value jumps back to 223, then fade from 223 to the next intensity value --> bad, because jump in intensity
B) Do not reset the "overriding" slider, hold intensity at 102 --> Here is the question when should we actually take the "overriding" slider into account and when not? When/How do we reset this slider?
C) Fade directly from 102 to the new intensity --> This could be very tricky to implement.

Maybe we can discuss these options (or add some), but I think none of them is a good practice or consistent...

omar86
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Re: Sliders in VC should be able to act like Simple Desk sliders, i.e. overriding the current cue level

Post by omar86 » Wed Nov 09, 2016 12:13 pm

I think the C option is the best one..

shortylight
Posts: 31
Joined: Sat Nov 21, 2015 7:06 pm
Location: Münster / Germany
Real Name: Martin Kurze

Re: Sliders in VC should be able to act like Simple Desk sliders, i.e. overriding the current cue level

Post by shortylight » Wed Nov 09, 2016 8:27 pm

Hi,

first of all thanks for all the response. Option "C" is quite the same idea as my suggestion for a manual reset. So option "C" is my favorite, too. I can imagine that it will be tricky to implement this, as you
  • need to get a trigger when the new scene starts,
  • need to know the new value of the related channel(s),
  • need to know the fade in time of the new scene.
On base of this you could do the "reset" as a faded transition between the value of the "overriding" slider and the new scene's channel value. The time for the transition could be the same time as the fade in time of the scene. A manual reset would start the same kind of transition just with a predefined time and the last value of the channel(s) before "overriding" as the target value.

Maybe this helps. I am looking forward to this new feature!

Regards Martin

mlohrey
Posts: 114
Joined: Mon Apr 20, 2015 5:07 am
Real Name: Mark Lohrey

Re: Sliders in VC should be able to act like Simple Desk sliders, i.e. overriding the current cue level

Post by mlohrey » Wed Nov 09, 2016 10:53 pm

In some other lighting software I have used, the approach to this is issue is pretty straight forward and basically the same behaviour that you would see in simple desk.

If you choose to over-ride a channel then that value persists until you clear the change.

My recommendation would be to have a slider that monitors the output of the channel and then if the operator chooses to adjust that level the slider turns red, as in done in the simple desk, and then has a button that clears the change and returns the channel to the level specified by the running cue. (I guess a fade could be incorporated here)

And then... a really nice feature would be able to save that level to the active scene (maybe with a button on the slider), effectively updating the scene. In my (limited) experience of doing lighting for theatre shows, especially during dress rehearsals and pre-peformances, the ability to make a small change and then save it to the scene for the next performance is really useful. This can be done in live edit I know, but sometimes that takes too long. At the moment, I scribble down my changes and then have to remember make the change to the scene at the end of the show. Relying on my memory or scribble notes is not a good thing. :)

I have no idea how hard this is to program and I really appreciate the people with the talent and the know-how who have created a really great bit of lighting software.

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